Wolf versus another animal

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Kyrozide
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Wolf versus another animal

Post by Kyrozide » Wed Mar 09, 2016 7:33 am

Reasons on why the wolf would win: They hunt together in groups! These predators are known for chasing other predators off a carcass most of the time, and can reach numbers of 10-15 wolves. Too many wolves can cause super packs.


Reasons on why the bear would win: Solitary, yet weighing in at 1,700 pounds, these meat-eaters have a measured 1,200 pounds bite force. They don't work in packs, but make up for it in size!


Who do you pick?? :wolf: :bear:
Last edited by Koa on Wed Mar 09, 2016 4:02 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: making topic title less misleading/broadening it to invite general discussion

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Re: Apex Predator

Post by Kamaal » Wed Mar 09, 2016 7:58 am

To be honest, I'd choose my fellow canines over here. They are very strategic and intelligent animals, so yep, that says it all on my part.
I ran out of snarky remarks, unfortunately.
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Re: Apex Predator

Post by La Striata » Wed Mar 09, 2016 12:11 pm

Sorry, but wolves are only apex predators where there are no big cats. They're totally dominated by tigers in India and Far Eastern Russia, to the point of being forced to work alone or in small groups.
I cannot see that wolves are in any way nobler in character than hyenas- Frederick Selous

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Re: Apex Predator

Post by Kamaal » Wed Mar 09, 2016 12:19 pm

La Striata wrote:Sorry, but wolves are only apex predators where there are no big cats. They're totally dominated by tigers in India and Far Eastern Russia, to the point of being forced to work alone or in small groups.
You have a point there a must admit, but the question mainly focuses on the two specific species. It's true that tigers can dominate those canines due to their huge frame and muscle power. I do really adore those felines. But yet again, if tigers were included in the question I''d choose them.
I ran out of snarky remarks, unfortunately.
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Re: Apex Predator

Post by La Striata » Wed Mar 09, 2016 3:45 pm

Kamaal wrote: You have a point there a must admit, but the question mainly focuses on the two specific species. It's true that tigers can dominate those canines due to their huge frame and muscle power. I do really adore those felines. But yet again, if tigers were included in the question I''d choose them.
The title should be more specific then.
I cannot see that wolves are in any way nobler in character than hyenas- Frederick Selous

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Re: Apex Predator

Post by Koa » Wed Mar 09, 2016 3:57 pm

I'll edit the thread title to make its purpose clearer and will broaden the title to invite more open discussion, i.e., if someone wants ton inquiry about where another animal's (besides a bear's) outcome in a face-off would be more favorable than that of a wolf's.
(Also, I could have sworn someone posted this somewhere in one of the wolf boards and had a similar "versus" topic, but I guess I am mistaken.)
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Re: Apex Predator

Post by Kyrozide » Wed Mar 09, 2016 4:16 pm

La Striata wrote:Sorry, but wolves are only apex predators where there are no big cats. They're totally dominated by tigers in India and Far Eastern Russia, to the point of being forced to work alone or in small groups.

I guess I wasn't specific enough, I was talking about North Amercia, sorry. Cougars are a problem for wolves, but MOST of the time, wolves come out on top.


Koa wrote:I'll edit the thread title to make its purpose clearer and will broaden the title to invite more open discussion, i.e., if someone wants ton inquiry about where another animal's (besides a bear's) outcome in a face-off would be more favorable than that of a wolf's.
(Also, I could have sworn someone posted this somewhere in one of the wolf boards and had a similar "versus" topic, but I guess I mistaken.)
Okay, I try my best to look all over the forums before posting a topic.

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Re: Wolf versus another animal

Post by alethe » Wed Mar 09, 2016 8:04 pm

A cougar can easily kill a wolf.


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Re: Apex Predator

Post by La Striata » Thu Mar 10, 2016 2:56 am

Abandoned Corpse wrote:I guess I wasn't specific enough, I was talking about North Amercia, sorry. Cougars are a problem for wolves, but MOST of the time, wolves come out on top.
By big cats, I mean the genus Panthera (lions, tigers, leopards etc.).
A cougar can easily kill a wolf.
Indeed:

Some Relevant information -
Douglas Smith, who leads the Yellowstones National Park Service's Yellowstone Wolf Project.

"Smith saw a male grizzly drive a pack of wolves away from an elk carcass, then make a "king of the hill" defense as the wolves darted in and out, trying, but failing, to wear him out.

But wolves do not always win. Males (Wolves), at 125 pounds, can go after a 110-pound female cougar if they are in a pack, but a lone wolf is a bagatelle for a 160-pound male cougar. Smith has recorded two instances of cougars ambushing and killing single wolves -- one an adult, the other a pup.

"A lion has two sets of lethal weapons -- teeth and claws, whereas wolves' principal weapon is just teeth," said National Park Service cougar specialist Kerry Murphy. Cougars can dominate as long as they stay in the rocks or in the forest, where they can climb a tree. "We're still talking about dogs and cats," he said.

May 19, 2003

By Guy Gugliotta
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, May 19, 2003; Page A07

http://www.wildraven.net/AmericanGrizzl ... _news.html

On another note...

Here's an interesting matchup few know about:

Wolves may encounter striped hyenas in Israel, Central Asia and India, usually in disputes over carcasses. Striped hyenas feed extensively on wolf-killed carcasses in areas where the two species interact. One-to-one, hyenas dominate wolves, but wolf packs can drive off single or outnumbered hyenas.[1][2] However, there was a case of a female striped hyena dominating 12 Arabian wolves.[3] Two cases are known however from southern Israel, where wolves and striped hyenas associated closely with each other in an apparently amicable way.[4]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gray_wolf ... ompetitors

Sources:
1. Mills, M. G. L.; Mills, Gus and Hofer, Heribert (1998). Hyaenas: status survey and conservation action plan. IUCN. pp. 24–25. ISBN 978-2-8317-0442-5.
2. Nayak, S.; Shah, S.; Borah, J. (2015). "Going for the kill: an observation of wolf-hyaena interaction in Kailadevi Wildlife Sanctuary, Rajasthan, India". Canid Biology & Conservation 18 (7): 27–29
3. "BBC Two - Wild Arabia, The Jewel of Arabia, Wolves vs hyena". BBC.
4. "Striped hyenas in gray wolf packs: cooperation, commensalism or singular aberration?" (PDF). Zoology in the Middle East. February 2016. Retrieved February 20, 2016.
I cannot see that wolves are in any way nobler in character than hyenas- Frederick Selous

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Re: Apex Predator

Post by Kyrozide » Thu Mar 10, 2016 7:32 am

La Striata wrote:
Abandoned Corpse wrote:I guess I wasn't specific enough, I was talking about North Amercia, sorry. Cougars are a problem for wolves, but MOST of the time, wolves come out on top.
By big cats, I mean the genus Panthera (lions, tigers, leopards etc.).
A cougar can easily kill a wolf.
Indeed:

Some Relevant information -
Douglas Smith, who leads the Yellowstones National Park Service's Yellowstone Wolf Project.

"Smith saw a male grizzly drive a pack of wolves away from an elk carcass, then make a "king of the hill" defense as the wolves darted in and out, trying, but failing, to wear him out.

But wolves do not always win. Males (Wolves), at 125 pounds, can go after a 110-pound female cougar if they are in a pack, but a lone wolf is a bagatelle for a 160-pound male cougar. Smith has recorded two instances of cougars ambushing and killing single wolves -- one an adult, the other a pup.

"A lion has two sets of lethal weapons -- teeth and claws, whereas wolves' principal weapon is just teeth," said National Park Service cougar specialist Kerry Murphy. Cougars can dominate as long as they stay in the rocks or in the forest, where they can climb a tree. "We're still talking about dogs and cats," he said.

May 19, 2003

By Guy Gugliotta
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, May 19, 2003; Page A07

http://www.wildraven.net/AmericanGrizzl ... _news.html

On another note...

Here's an interesting matchup few know about:

Wolves may encounter striped hyenas in Israel, Central Asia and India, usually in disputes over carcasses. Striped hyenas feed extensively on wolf-killed carcasses in areas where the two species interact. One-to-one, hyenas dominate wolves, but wolf packs can drive off single or outnumbered hyenas.[1][2] However, there was a case of a female striped hyena dominating 12 Arabian wolves.[3] Two cases are known however from southern Israel, where wolves and striped hyenas associated closely with each other in an apparently amicable way.[4]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gray_wolf ... ompetitors

Sources:
1. Mills, M. G. L.; Mills, Gus and Hofer, Heribert (1998). Hyaenas: status survey and conservation action plan. IUCN. pp. 24–25. ISBN 978-2-8317-0442-5.
2. Nayak, S.; Shah, S.; Borah, J. (2015). "Going for the kill: an observation of wolf-hyaena interaction in Kailadevi Wildlife Sanctuary, Rajasthan, India". Canid Biology & Conservation 18 (7): 27–29
3. "BBC Two - Wild Arabia, The Jewel of Arabia, Wolves vs hyena". BBC.
4. "Striped hyenas in gray wolf packs: cooperation, commensalism or singular aberration?" (PDF). Zoology in the Middle East. February 2016. Retrieved February 20, 2016.


Woah, well I'll try to do more research next time, but this helped a lot. Thanks La Striata

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